to agree to not disagree

[kureno-rooster.livejournal.com]

http://www.themanime.org/viewreview.php?id=120

If you put the harsh wording aside you can see that the review has a point. So my questions are how and when
How does Naruto transcend the limits of shonen series (if you honestly think it ever does)
When: at what story arc or with what events

I always believed that even in likeing something you must acknowledge its faults. I still like Naruto but even I wonder why it has such a great appeal. I think its just likeable characters.

Comments

[kureno-rooster.livejournal.com]

I am not hating on the series just really curious about what others think. I agree with the series on many points but I still like the series. The manga more so that the anime. (I'm not a fan of what pierrot did to it)

[kureno-rooster.livejournal.com]

I meant a agree with the reviewer

[doomsdayblaze.livejournal.com]

Couldn't you just have edited the post o.O?

[donna-c-punk.livejournal.com]

The only reaction I can offer the review is simple: There's nothing new under the sun. ::shrugs::

Despite it's faults and predicabilities, I love Naruto. When I continue with a series where I don't like the main character much, there's something else going on under the surface. The characters are what keep me coming back, not so much the storyline.

[kureno-rooster.livejournal.com]

yeah i figured that it must be the characters but. I have been surprised by the series despite the predictabilities such as the fight at the valley of the end.

[donna-c-punk.livejournal.com]

Kishimoto's tossed a couple curve balls in there. I dig the characters and find the mystery behind the Akatsuki pretty intriguing. I'm still wondering exactly WHY Yondaime knew the procedure to seal a demon inside of a human being, since that seems to be knowledge that not so nice folks have at their disposal ... Stuff like that, yeah, makes me wanna keep going.

[hangookmoongurl.livejournal.com]

Sure everything has its faults. I do have some complaints about the series but the pros outweigh all that. :]

Can't really pin point why this series "transcends" the shonen genre. Maybe it may be that it has a variety of characters, good animation (and great artistic ability on Kishimoto-sensei's part), a good underlying and predominant message through out the series (for the little kiddies out there and for those of us who need more motivation o_o;), really likeable characters as you pointed out (but a lot of series have these, too)... it's a combination of everything that made Naruto so successful, I think. Oh, and can't forget the amazing seiyuus (*Insert fangirl squeal for Sugiyama Noriaki*).

Ho ho, and I just managed to say a bunch of nothing. Hahaha, nothing new anyway. ;] Just saying that Naruto is as popular and successful as it is now for a reason. :]

[eleventyteen.livejournal.com]

It has the X factor. A series doesn't have to be outstanding or groundbreaking to gain such hard-core fans, it just needs that It that pulls people in. The character types and the outline (overall) is kind of typical, but the people and the storylines that Kishimoto's put into that mold are engaging and interesting enough to keep so many people going.

I mean, look at Harry Potter. I've read all six (and enjoyed most of the first five) but looking at it, seriously looking at it, it's pretty mediocre. (Despite what legions of fans say.) But it has enough X Factor, to make people care about these characters and their lives, despite the quality of the writing. There plenty of works that are very well-written, but they don't make people truly care about the characters, and invest so much time and energy in them. (Disclaimer: I, under no circumstances, am putting Naruto on the same level as Harry Potter. NO WAY.)

Just because you like something doesn't make it good, just because you don't like something, doesn't make it bad. I've been detached from fandom for quite a while, but haven't re-read Naruto yet (nor am I up to date), so I can't make a useful or somewhat objective review right now. But I DO know, that love my sannin, Gai, Lee, Kakashi, Naruto, Neji, Itachi and Kisame, to PIECES. Naruto has gotten far more out of me than most anime. (Excepting GW and Slam Dunk)

[domlandbubbles.livejournal.com]

Someone at F_W called Naruto "Harry Potter with ninjas." Heh.

[eighty.livejournal.com]

Which saddens me because I've been rereading HP and making a list of HP/Naruto similarities. I was going to post when I thought I was done. :( Now I just feel stupid and defeated. XD

[lousyitachi.livejournal.com]

To me, this review is summarized by one prevailing thought that was going through my head while reading it:

"It sounds like this guy hasn't seen more than 10 episodes..."

[hangookmoongurl.livejournal.com]

And to that sir, I shall say, "True dat." All misspelled words are intentional. xD

[donna-c-punk.livejournal.com]

You want "fair and balanced" reporting? What d'you think this is, FOX News Network?

[randomsome1.livejournal.com]

Yeah. Maybe (personally) it makes a difference that I came in partially through the chuunin exams, or that I wasn't hardcore into anime beforehand. Eh. *shrugs*

[caninedreamer.livejournal.com]

Agreed, and as well hasn't read further than what has been released by Viz because I remember him using terminology that is only native to the Viz dub ("Make Out Paradise")I believe, which is what its called in translated official books.

so there's where you get "Don't criticize what you can't understand." or such.

[domlandbubbles.livejournal.com]

Eesh. Well, at least to me, the review came off like someone looking a little harder for faults simply because the show was so popular. And I wonder, like lousyitachi, just how many episodes the reviewer saw. Because while the Haku/Zabuza storyline was quite nice, I'm happiest when all the rest of the protagonists show up.

If I had done a review when first watching the series (I saw the cartoon before I read the comic) I would've criticized the excessive use of flashbacks...to the previous episode. In fact, that still kinda bugs me a little.

[domlandbubbles.livejournal.com]

Wait. And antagonists. Gotta give all the bad boys (and Tayuya) some love.

[memoriez-lost.livejournal.com]

Well, there has to be a reason why its so popular, no? If it was as bad as the writer put it as, there wouldn't be any fans as all!

Hmm.. I doubt the reviewer has read the manga.

[lousyitachi.livejournal.com]

You know what?

How dare he imply that the anime and by extention its fandom is cliche and immature.

That poopiehead.

[memoriez-lost.livejournal.com]

It's true! I AM immature XD

Poopiehead. I like the sound of that =DD

Sure, Naruto can get a lil' chiched sometimes, but Kishimoto gave us quite a few surprises too. I bet that reviewer based it off filler arcs =/

[oneiroelpida.livejournal.com]

Eh, like someone said above me, it doesn't sound like this reviewer has seen more than 10 episodes. Honestly, it's the end of the Haku and Zabuza arc that made me go, "There's something different about this series." and as it continued, I kept feeling that way. I've never watched a series before that honestly played with my emotions the way Naruto has, and I'm saying that in a good way. FMA had some pretty harsh scenes, but that's not what I'm meaning. I mean the way that Naruto has turned characters I utterly hated (Neji and Gaara specifically) and made them into my favorite characters later on. I was so convinced that nothing could possibly make me like them because they were such jerks to begin with (and psycho on Gaara's part) but then we hear their backstory. This was enough to make me go, "You poor things!" but add on to that their reform and I absolutely freakin' love those two now. That's the strength of Naruto to me- the idea that there are the unsavable evils (Orochimaru and Itachi) but that some are just misguided. And I love that Naruto is able to see that in his opponents. Despite all the crap that has happened to Naruto, he hasn't lost his innocence and he still believes that people can be redeemed. I think that's what makes him, as a shounen lead, so different than others I've seen. He's not 'trying' to be tough anymore, he just honestly believes in himself. It's naive, but it's adorable.

[lousyitachi.livejournal.com]

And hey, exactly how fucking predictable could it have been that Sasuke DIES within the first 16 episodes (well, temporarily)?

This guy was full of it.

[darkenedwings.livejournal.com]

Dude, Naruto is full of things you don't expect.

I totally agree with the Haku and Zabuza thing. What do you want to bet that most people thought what my friends and I did, and thought Haku and Zabuza would survive and turn good and stuff? And then all of a sudden you're like... "...holy shit, they died." And the things with Neji and Chouji during the Sasuke rescue arc?

And how predictable is it that Sasuke escaped to get to Orochimaru? I mean, there were points during that Naruto vs. Sasuke fight where you think Naruto got through to Sasuke, but then he turns around and just attacks Naruto again. You think after that final attack that he might stick around, but he just turns and leaves. Seriously... predictable, my ass.

[domlandbubbles.livejournal.com]

Yeah, the bit about Kishimoto not being a great artist kinda made me go "whu?" Because he doesn't do the cartoon. Then again if the reviewer was talking about character design...

Um. Naruto is the only manga I've read where I could easily tell the characters apart even if I hadn't seen them in the cartoon (meaning in color). (I had a spastic anime then manga back-and-forth thing going for a while.) I read some manga where I can barely discern the characters' sex. So, with Naruto's cast of thousands, I'm quite impressed, really at how distinctive they all are.

Then again, the Uchiha unitard has something to be desired...

[domlandbubbles.livejournal.com]

Er, forgot about Haku and Dei Dei.

Well, Haku was on purpose and Deidara is just too fabulous for one gender (even if his hand mouths aren't original.) Hee.

[ninja-demongirl.livejournal.com]

is deidara a girl or boy?

[domlandbubbles.livejournal.com]

Dei Dei uses male personal pronouns. That's good enough for me. Some fans think Dei Dei's a girl regardless of his pronouns. I think the crack's more fun if he's a he. Isn't this:

cuter if Dei Dei is a boy?

[acemyth.livejournal.com]

Archetypes and patterns are EVIL, don't you know. Downtrodden heroes are way overdone! Down with coming-of-age journeys! Boo for wise old elders! So what if they've been in our collective consciousness since forever? It's not like the whole point is how you write them or anything.

Naruto eventually achieving Hokage and getting stronger is so PREDICTABLE. I mean, if there were any OTHER plot threads in there which are not obligatory standard fare plot, then yeah, that might have filled up forums of dumbfounded speculating people who go WTF at every third chapter due to an unexpected development (and in case of fillers just WTF in general). But no. NOBODY cares about subplots and character development.

Also, Kanashimi Wo Yasashisa Ni is wannabe metal and toilet metaphors are teh shiznit!

[randomsome1.livejournal.com]

Downtrodden heroes are so awful, everyone should just be Gary Stus! No hassle, no stress, no real fighting, everyone loves them automatically, and Sturuto never musses his hair during a fight, EVAR.

...
>.>
(never mind me)

[orinara.livejournal.com]

I love that song. I'm trying to learn the words so I can sound like I speak Japanese. O_O

Anyway, I admit that I watched the first few episodes and was like, eh, whatever. But I kept watching it because some of my friends were so obsessed with it. These are people I trust, because they like a lot of the same things I do.

Sasuke bores me, and he's the main focus of a lot of the story. Sakura is still annoying. I don't watch it for them, and in the first few episodes that's all you see, so I can understand why the reviewer was hating.

It's all Lee and Gai, baby. All Lee and Gai. Oh, and everyone else, but especially the Green Beasts. They make me wanna watch just to see what the hell they'll do next. And the backstories of everyone are great...Chouji springs to mind.

Basically I said everything that has already been said. *gnaws on review*

[ninja-demongirl.livejournal.com]

Once the chunnin exams start the seris is interesting cause its gets a good plot. thats my opinion

[eighty.livejournal.com]

I think we could just sum it up and stop all further conversation by saying, "that guy is full of shit."

ta-da!

[bmg.livejournal.com]

Wow, that website has some shitty font. It's so damn tiny.

[darkenedwings.livejournal.com]

Why do people automatically assume that just because an anime is popular, it's gotta suck? It really doesn't make that much sense, when you think about it.

How many animes have such a HUGE variety of characters, and all with such incredibly developed pasts? All the secondary characters have full names, for the most part... and even the characters that have no point in the plot at all (like the audience during the Chuunin exams) all look different, as opposed to a lot of other anime, where the background audiences and such all look the same?

Plus, the MUSIC. The background music itself is almost enough reason to love Naruto... the way the Japanese flute and harp and such is mixed with guitar is bloody AMAZING...

I think this guy is just full of crap.

[thomasvye.livejournal.com]

Aw, sounds like this reviewer is kinda sore because something is popular...

Everyone knows it's not what you tell, it's the way you tell it. ^^ And I agree; this show just has that 'je nais sais quios'...it's just good. Really really good.

[arandomstudent.livejournal.com]

Too predictable? Too cliche? Bad character designs? (I won't mention the sountracks because I don't watch anime.)

A lot of stories are very predictable. In fact, some stories begin at the end and then roll back to the real beginning. Revealing the ending is nothing new. (If you don't like obvious endings, why are you living? You know you're going to die, anyway. Sooo cliche.)

Now here's what I think really counts: the side characters (very interesting character designs for the rookie nine, teachers, and some chuunin examiners!) and smaller plots (smaller than the grand plot of "Naruto becomes Hokage"). We know for sure Naruto will become acknowledged (the final destination), but we don't know if Sasuke will ever kill Itachi, if Gaara is indeed alive, if Yondaime is really Naruto's father, if Deidara is a boy or a girl, etc. There's far too many turns and detours for me to know how we're going to reach that final destination.

As for the drawing style, I appreciate how Kishimoto's style seems to have changed a little from the beginning. (You'll get this if you compare recent chapters to some of earlier chapters.) I really like his lines, for unexplained reasons.

[mibu-roshi.livejournal.com]

There is a forum on the site.... I suppose if we all feel strongly about the flaws in this review we could all join and post about it there??

Just an idea.