Questions On Naruto's Parents

[redbrunja.livejournal.com]

Do we know how old Naruto's parents where when they died?

Also, does it strike anyone else as really weird that Jiraiya had forgotten Kushina's name? Because I am very bad with names myself, but I think I would remember the girl who married my beloved student and had a child whom she named after the main character of my first novel.

I mean, really Jiraiya, what is up with that?

Comments

[cherryfruit.livejournal.com]

Same reason no one ever thought it was worth mentioning that his father's the Hokage.

Oh, sure, the tragic orphan should know that he has a demon in him, but telling him he had a kind, powerful Hokage father who'd be proud of him, and was close to both his teachers? That'd just be spoiling him, clearly.

Seriously, what the hell. The Konoha adults have convenient plot device amnesia! Or they're just dicks. It's possible.

[premium-shaday.livejournal.com]

Yeah... Yeah.

[xevochic.livejournal.com]

The Konoha adults have convenient plot device amnesia! Or they're just dicks.

Considering the fact that they hold tournaments where children beat the hell out of each other, I'm guessing the latter. lol

[redbrunja.livejournal.com]

That does make a lot of sense.

Reading Naruto, I'll periodically step back, and go, 'jesus you people are fucked up.' Especially the adults.

Hot icon, by the way.

[libraire.livejournal.com]

Actually, didn't Naruto find out he had Kyuubi accidentally? D: That probably caused a lot more trouble than we were shown, in the council and all. I think they'd be the ones wanting to keep it all hush hush.

Though I do agree that Kakashi or Jiraiya should've said SOMETHING or dropped SOME KIND of hint for the poor kid. However forbidden it might have been for them, it would have been enough.

[natsumeh.livejournal.com]

Exactly.

[musogato.livejournal.com]

THIS. D<

*flails arms*

[premium-shaday.livejournal.com]

I'm pretty sure selective memory is overused as some kind of dramatic plot device in Naruto. Don't forget Jiraiya also forgot he was Naruto's god-father.

And, no, we don't know how old they were when they died, but I would pin it around 30. They seemed pretty young, but they couldn't be THAT young. So, over 24, at least.

[redbrunja.livejournal.com]

That old? Frankly, I was thinking 24 at an upper limit. Neither of them seemed that old to me, and I don't think life expectations for ninjas are that long. I mean, Kakashi's considered an old veteran at 29.

[leaf-kunoichi.livejournal.com]

I think it is due to fan fiction that people assume that Jiraiya and Minato were super tight. Then again, fan fiction also usually depicts the Fourth as a happy go lucky guy much like Nartuo. According to the manga he was more serious and it was Naruto's mom who has a personality closer to his.

Yes, he was Jiraiya's star pupal but he also is the hermit who left Konoha. We don't know if they were close, how close they were or if Jiraiya was even around when Naruto was born.

[chirigami.livejournal.com]

I would assume that they were close, after all Minato decided to name his kid after the character in Jiraiya's book and he's usually mentioned several times by him, especially when comparing Naruto to someone - looks, abilities... yadda.

[premium-shaday.livejournal.com]

Jiraiya did say he was as proud of Minato as he would have been of his own son. So, yeah, they were probably tight. So maybe Jiraiya is a dick as well for not looking after his own god-son/psuedo-grand child?

[leaf-kunoichi.livejournal.com]

And for forgetting who Minato had a child with, for forgetting the kid was his godchild, and for leaving Naruto alone while growing up.

[sanee-ftw.livejournal.com]

LJ-cut please. Some people (like me) aren't current with the manga. =)

[redbrunja.livejournal.com]

Fixed.

[chirigami.livejournal.com]

Whose to say they were married though? And that it was publicly known that Minato and Kushina were having a child? I could imagine it could be a hushhush matter since the Yondaime had many enemies and it could put his girlfriend/wife/mother of his child and unborn child in a lot of danger.
This is one of the few reasons I can give for people's behavior and treatment to Naruto - ie, Kakashi and Jiraiya and their lack of .. being there for him when he was growing up, unless they were in the shadows making sure nothing happened. Maybe not everyone knew, only a special select few and they're trying to keep this information until Naruto is old enough to handle it; 'cause I think learning that your father was a Hokage [you're dream] and the one who sealed a demon in your stomach - and the reason everyone hated you - might be a bit of a bombshell.
[I also have this awesome dream that Kushina is alive somewhere, and they're waiting for her to come back to tell him everything ;o;]

[chirigami.livejournal.com]

Great minds think alike!

ohyeah, since I'm thinking about this.
There is also the matter of Kushina being from a different village, many other villages - Whirlpool if still standing as well as Konoha itself - might not be so accepting of such a union.. so that could be fitting into the equation of people just not knowing. [political jeopardy, ohnoes!] Unless, like in many fanfics, Whirlpool was destroyed and Konoha is where they were relocated.

Re: it's a conspiracy!

[hieronymousb.livejournal.com]

Ooh. Your theory that it had something to do with Madara is actually really interesting, and it may be correct. After all, remember this little conversation?

http://www.onemanga.com/Naruto/370/12/
http://www.onemanga.com/Naruto/370/13/
http://www.onemanga.com/Naruto/370/15/

It seems Minato took some of his secrets to the grave, but it's true; if Certain People knew about Naruto's parentage, then it's quite possible that Naruto would've been in danger. And now that we know Konoha has some underground shady dealings (what with "The Elders"/Danzou/the whole Uchiha business), it's beginning to look as if Konoha could not entirely be trusted, either.

In a certain light, it may have actually been better for Naruto for people to have simply thought he was a troublemaking, talentless kid, as opposed to the 4th Hokage's son; we see how Sasuke has been targeted and manipulated all because of his esteemed blood, and we see what this has done to him. Had people known Naruto's bloodline, it's quite likely that people would have attempted to make Naruto their pawn. Instead, with the exception of Akatsuki, most powerful figures have simply chosen to ignore Naruto and focus on Sasuke. Interesting parallel.

Re: it's a conspiracy!

[chirigami.livejournal.com]

"And now that we know Konoha has some underground shady dealings (what with "The Elders"/Danzou/the whole Uchiha business), it's beginning to look as if Konoha could not entirely be trusted, either."

Which usually got my thoughts about Kushina's whereabouts along the lines of her being basically prohibited from ever seeing Naruto, from even being near the village, being run out of town or so pissed off over the outcome of what happened with Minato that she exiled herself. 'cause I could imagine without being a full blown citizen of the village, she wouldn't have been able to take Naruto with her - along with him having the Kyuubi in him - or maybe even see him... as it would also give someone proof of his parentage and someone might connect the dots. But, we won't know until Kishimoto tells us and I heard from the fanbook that we might find out soon.
Gah, I'm on such a Kushina kick o-o;

But seriously, this whole Madara thing really does make sense. Good call ~

Re: it's a conspiracy!

[redbrunja.livejournal.com]

You know, that is a really good point. I hadn't really thought about how enemies of Minato could take advantage of Naruto, or that if it was well known he comes from a powerful line he could have people coming after him.

Re: it's a conspiracy!

[redbrunja.livejournal.com]

LOL, you mean like how Sasuke did with Madara after finding out his entire life of revenge was a big fat lie?

Yeah, just like that.

And while I would HATE to have Kushina be alive, simply because I can't believe someone with Naruto's personality type would abandon her kid (unless she had... amnesia!) I can imagine Naruto being like, 'awesome! I get a mom!' and SAKURA being like, 'hey, bitch, where the hell have you been the last 15 years? Do you know what Naruto's been through?' *punch*

Re: it's a conspiracy!

[redbrunja.livejournal.com]

You know, I personally assume Rin and Kushina both died in the Nine Tails attack. And actually, Kakashi is one of the few people who I can give a pass on for not taking care of Naruto, if you consider that at eighteen he lost his last team mate, his sensei, and his sensei's wife in just about one fell swoop. I can easily see him not being able to separate 'innocent sensei's child' from 'demon that killed the last remaining people I loved.'

Re: it's a conspiracy!

[redbrunja.livejournal.com]

Agreed.

I love Kakashi to death, but he is a horrible teacher and did ill by both Sakura and Naruto.

Re: it's a conspiracy!

[hieronymousb.livejournal.com]

I'm glad I'm not the only one who doesn't want Kushina to be alive. Not because I have anything against her; quite the opposite. I just can't imagine her being alive without her whereabouts having some extremely dumb and unsatisfying explanation. Seems like most of the fandom is on a huge Kushina kick lately, and my hopes just aren't high. Sorry. I am fully prepared to eat my words if Kishi's explanation for where Kushina is/what condition she's in is an awesome explanation, but I'm not holding my breath.

Of course, being dead isn't really keeping some characters (coughItachicough) from having their characterizations mangled!

Re: it's a conspiracy!

[redbrunja.livejournal.com]

Yeah, I love Kushina and would LOVE to learn more about her (and glad the fandom is paying attention) but I would like flashbacks, please, because I don't think there is anyway that Naruto could NOT be an orphan that would make ANY kind of sense.

Of course, being dead isn't really keeping some characters (coughItachicough) from having their characterizations mangled!

Word. You know, him having good reasons for killing his clan is one thing. Itachi as a loving person who's favorite word is 'peace' is just... no. Just, no.

Re: it's a conspiracy!

[redbrunja.livejournal.com]

You totally should write that, because even though I would hate for Kushina to be alive (I think she's cool, but there is no reason on earth that I would buy her abandoning her child for 15 years) it is an awesome idea to toy around with fic for.

[redbrunja.livejournal.com]

You have a point. But I do think that a pregnancy and relationship (it seemed like they were living together) would be rather hard to hide.

But on the other hand, Kunanai and Asuma seemed to manage it....

[magical-poof.livejournal.com]

Well, maybe Minato was having just a little too much fun in the Red Light District (since Kushina was picking up a bunch of awesome tips from Jiraiya's books and all...) XDDDD

[grindell107.livejournal.com]

I'm betting Minato and Kushina met during the chuunin exams. I'm also betting they weren't married and their union would have been frowned upon because Kushina was from a rival village. Because of this its hard to say how much contact they had, or how well Kushina and jiraiya knew one another.

[redbrunja.livejournal.com]

You know, them meeting durning the Chuunin exams is an interesting idea. But I have to say, considering that Jiraiya's student married her, and Jiraiya was clearly comfortable chatting with her, I find it hard to believe that they DIDN'T know each other fairly well, if only by association.

[hieronymousb.livejournal.com]

Honestly? And this is very likely me trying to put logic onto a situation where there probably is none? I always assumed Naruto's parentage was kept secret for one of two reasons, if not both of these reasons. The first is, when you've grown up essentially being an outcast already, I think it'd be somewhat traumatizing to learn that you were (albeit inadvertently) responsible for your father's death, and your father is the one who sealed the demon in you which has made you an outcast and made you miserable. That's a pretty hefty double-whammy of potential angst and stress. After what happened with Kakashi and the angst over his father's legacy/family, it could be that no one told Naruto who his father was in the hopes of sparing him from any internal repercussions that might stem from this.

The other theory I had is that perhaps Jiraiya et al did not want Naruto to become over-confident and rely too much on the high hopes of his parentage to achieve his dreams, as opposed to focusing on hard work. I mean, from Jiraiya's and Tsunade's conversations, it seems that they do support him in his dream of becoming Hokage, but they don't make a big show of this to him, which leads me to think that they want him to believe in himself and not get lazy just because everyone else tells him he's a shoo-in. If Naruto knew he was the 4th Hokage's own kid, who is to say that he might not think to himself, "well hot damn, I'm guaranteed the position now", get all arrogant, and not work as hard to get there on his own merits? Of course, this far into things, I don't think that'd be the case, but if you told Little Naruto what I just mentioned, it could've happened.

But, again, this is probably me attempting to put an explanation onto something which has none.

Re: i pose ye questions then

[andricuskollari.livejournal.com]

Erm, butting in very rudely, but-- all of your examples in your first question share one trait in common: each of the children knew and interacted with their families, often for long periods of time (at least enough to semi-remember them, and know that they had existence), beforehand. Naruto would've never interacted with his parents. Sasuke was eight when his family was massacred, and it's difficult if not totally impossible to convince a child, to just forget about having a family all-together, or that they're simply gone, or any other bits of unrealistic poppycock alltogether.

And so on and so forth with the other characters. And if you mean, as in, 'everyone in Konoha seems to have been through pretty traumatizing stuff-- why only special treat Naruto?', because that's a decent question as well-- it could've been for any number of theories, couldn't it? The Fourth could've said beforehand, 'spare him what tragedy you can', or, Tsunade, Jiraiya, and a number of people seemed to hold a rather large amount of fondness for the Fourth and really, his child. I can easily see them participating in a plan to keep away as much unnecessary angst as possible from Naruto, at least while they could.

On your second piece of questions, a lot of that can be accounted for through character bias and differing opinions. Tsunade and Jiraiya did do selfish acts-- but that's what humans often do. For example, I might dump an icecream cone into my sister's lap, and after that I might pull her hair and step on her foot. But it doesn't by any means mean that I truly /hate/ or even, /don't care/ for her and her wellbeing. Even for more serious things-- and the Naruto manga has proven timelessly that the characters often do things without truly meaning them.

As far as the manga's going now-- Itachi completely ruined Sasuke's life in, really, most senses of that word. But it did not ever mean that he lacked love for Sasuke, or cared for him any less, or was able to dismiss concern over Sasuke's well-being. People show their love and care in different ways-- in Naruto, especially so, because they are ninja, in all truths, and built into situations where hardly anyone can be as loving and sincere as they would like to be.

Jiraiya and Tsunade were certainly well-wrapped into their own angsts when they were first introduced, and, to a point, still as so later on and even in the current parts of the manga. But I think any of their actions, any of that selfishness, can ultimately be seen through in the end-- because it is proven time and time again that they both do care for Naruto (and others, obviously). What may seem like selfish acts to you, may not seem half as bad to them. Even though Tsunade and Jiraiya did a lot of awful things, I can certainly see them making sacrifices for Naruto in other certain things-- importantly: depending upon what those things are. They obviously didn't see it quite so important to be there when he was a child and going through such rough (to say the least) times, but Jiraiya saw it as important to make Naruto stronger to protect himself, he saw it as important to let Naruto make and cultivate his own decisions and beliefs, etc. Tsunade valued highly Naruto's health and well-being (and continually does throughout the manga).

People each have different worries and different views. It might seem unempathetic to one person to watch someone scrape their knee and not try to aide them-- but that same person might not bat an eye at someone who's anxious over a bad test grade. And one person might worry over people who are emotionally sore, but not be as concerned over people who are physically injured. What might seem really horrible to you as an action, might be seen as very justified or even acceptable to another person. People all love in different ways. People are all very differing.

If you liked chocolate ice cream, and your friend liked vanilla-- doesn't mean that your friend appreciates ice cream in general any less than you do, just because they prefer other flavors. And it definitely doesn't mean that Tsunade and Jiraiya would be unwilling to make sacrifices or do kind deeds for Naruto, just because they value different ways of showing their love for him than you might, if that makes sense. :F

[redbrunja.livejournal.com]

Actually, those are both really good reasons. I CAN see how learning about his parentage would just make things harder for him.

[clckwrk-strlght.livejournal.com]

To be completely irreverent and more than slightly cracked... Jiraiya probably didn't remember her name because he was too busy staring at her rack.

Wasn't she like a super pretty kunoichi from somewhere far away? And then she was a married woman. With a kid.
Take every opportunity to appreciate beauty.

Don't flame me!! (/o\) *cower*

[redbrunja.livejournal.com]

See, that actually makes a lot of sense....

[clckwrk-strlght.livejournal.com]

^^\/
I make sense sometimes. Learn something new every day.

[schwertundfeder.livejournal.com]

I lol'd

[senior-witch.livejournal.com]

The other question that has been bothering me: What about his other relatives? He might have grandparents, uncles, aunts, cousins that are still alive...

[redbrunja.livejournal.com]

Considering there was a war on, I can actually see him not having aunts and uncles and grandparents, if both Naruto's parents were only children or only had one or two siblings who then died...